Off The Hook
We are a group of private investigators, bounty hunters / fugitive recovery agents, and bail bondsmen that have been in this line of work for over twenty five years and have many stories to tell. We have traveled all over the country catching fugitives and bringing them back to have their day in court. With our years of experience we are trying to educate the public about bail and why it is a needed part of our judicial system.
Off The Hook
A Conversation with Criminal Defense Attorney David Gross
The legal system can feel like a maze of confusion, but our conversation with criminal defense attorney David Gross cuts through the complexity with straight talk and insider knowledge you won't find elsewhere.
David brings a fascinating perspective to the table—having worked as a police officer in the notoriously rough "Murder Mount" (Rocky Mount), then as a private investigator, before earning his law degree at Chapel Hill and establishing his criminal defense practice across Eastern North Carolina.
We dive deep into DWI laws, where David reveals game-changing information most people never learn until it's too late. Did you know you can be convicted of driving while impaired even if your blood alcohol is below 0.08? Or that there's a little-known "pre-arrest test" option that lets you skip field sobriety tests entirely? These aren't just legal trivia—they're potential lifesavers when blue lights flash in your rearview mirror.
The financial reality of a DWI conviction is staggering: between attorney fees, insurance hikes (which can multiply your premium five times), court costs, and other expenses, you're looking at $10,000-$12,000 for a single mistake. That makes that $40 Uber ride look like the bargain of the century.
Perhaps most valuable is our discussion about concealed carry insurance. David shares a compelling case where his client, who'd only had USCCA coverage for a month or two, faced serious charges after defending his wife with a firearm. The insurance company immediately stepped in, covering everything from attorney fees to flying in specialized experts from across the country—potentially saving his client hundreds of thousands in expenses.
Whether you're a gun owner, occasional drinker, or simply someone who wants to understand your rights better, this episode delivers practical knowledge that could save you from life-altering legal consequences. Subscribe now and share with someone who needs to hear this before they learn the hard way.
When people are released from jail, they have the responsibility to appear in court, but some of these people choose to go on the run.
Speaker 2:They go back home to mommy.
Speaker 1:And that is when these guys come into the picture. So sit back and listen to the Off the Hook Podcast with Chad and Rob Very fine people on both sides. These are real stories, but the names have been changed.
Speaker 2:What's going on, guys?
Speaker 3:This is Rob. I'm Chad and we have a special guest today.
Speaker 2:Mr David Gross from the Gross Law Group. Everybody give him a big round of applause.
Speaker 4:How's it?
Speaker 2:going. At least it's not crickets. Dave here is a good friend of ours. We've known him for a long time, does some good stuff, man, and we figured we'd have them on on the podcast today, kind of go over some, some questions that you know, some general questions that people may have.
Speaker 3:Right and we're going to try to cover some things that you know you may have wondered about in the legal field, that you just don't know about or you've heard it might be rumors and you, but you want to know the truth. This is the guy to set it straight.
Speaker 2:Yeah, man, because he's got this big billboard right outside of Hampstead. It was arms crossed. It says you want to fight about it and I'm like, yep, that's Dave, that's Dave, that's the guy you want on your side, yeah well, if you need somebody to go to battle for you, I'm your guy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, we did that you. So last summer we did the Kempton trial and that was very interesting to see how that panned out. Not a lot of people liked the guy, but I was kind of horrified. Yeah, apparently it was just me and you.
Speaker 3:Colin.
Speaker 2:Oh man, what is this guy?
Speaker 3:No, no no, no, he used to be on TV, local TV.
Speaker 2:Oh gotcha.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he does something for the.
Speaker 2:Yeah, somebody's at our door, guys, we try to lock it, keep them out, yeah. So, anyway, back to that Kempton trial. You know we had Jason Smith on the podcast here, mm-hmm, yeah, I heard that one and I gave him a little bit of crap about the whole body cam being silenced and he just kind of looked at me like a death stare, jason, sorry, buddy, I had to do it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's an unfortunate thing that some officers do is they like to mute their body cam when they're having personal conversations? In the middle of an investigation, I had a witness too, that's right, that's right. That's right yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, he's off. He's off in the air. So anyway, I got some music for you. Hang on Ready.
Speaker 4:Is that Night Court? Uh-uh, it's.
Speaker 2:Matlock.
Speaker 3:Oh, we just had to do that to welcome my grandmother would think that this is awesome. Look man, you tell my grandparents where he's from, my grandmother actually went to school with Andy.
Speaker 2:Oh, really, yeah up in.
Speaker 3:Mount Airy yeah.
Speaker 2:Oh cool.
Speaker 4:He's from oh, that's right, he is from Mount Airy. Yeah, he's from Mount Airy. Yeah, he's from Mount Airy. Yeah, I went to the police academy with a guy that was from Mania and his grandfather owned a garage and they worked on all his cars. Oh yeah, so yeah, they'd go up there and pick them up and maintain them. He had a bunch of old classic cars.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they were filming Matlock here in Wilmington for years. Oh was it. Yeah, it was here. I didn't know A lot of it was filmed here. Matlock was yeah, I didn't know that. Yeah, not the Andy Griffith show, but Matlock.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was filmed here the courtroom scenes Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3:Yeah, go back in my time, yeah.
Speaker 4:I might check that out.
Speaker 3:Yeah, all right, I was in one of them. I had a lot of friends that were in episodes of it. Yeah, when they filmed here for extras.
Speaker 2:Man, that was a long time ago. All right, yeah, so.
Speaker 3:Dave Travis was on there, damn Really.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:That one was filmed here Cause I had friends that way, like all my gym buddies were going into a gym and stuff and like they had an altercation with Randy Travis in the episode. It was funny Wow.
Speaker 2:Wow, so Mr Gross, here is in a criminal defense attorney here in town, right, correct, okay, and how long you been practicing here Since?
Speaker 4:2010.
Speaker 2:2010. Wow, all right. In here since 2010, 2010 has been. Wow, all right. So tell us a little bit about before you got in as an attorney were you a bondsman ever?
Speaker 4:uh, well, I actually took the. Uh, I had my bonding license. I didn't actually write any bonds, but I um yeah, I was a police officer in rocky mount, oh yeah, for a little while and then, when I quit doing that, I got my private investigator's license and my bondsman's license. Did that for a couple years and then, um well, I was finishing up my degree wow, that's awesome.
Speaker 3:you understand where we're coming from from all angles, so that's cool, yeah, yeah, that's awesome you understand where we're coming from from all angles.
Speaker 4:That's cool, yeah. Yeah, pat had kind of a circuitous route to the law.
Speaker 2:So where did you go to law school?
Speaker 4:at Chapel Hill.
Speaker 2:Chapel Hill Mm-hmm Right on Very respectable school, I guess.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I was there in 2009 when they won the championship.
Speaker 2:Oh, I bet you that was a party time. Yeah, that was a good time, but all right. So Rocky Mount, all right, let me tell you. All right, guys, if you guys listening don't know what Rocky Mount is, I'll tell you. It's called Murder Mount for a reason. That place is horrible.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that was in the late 90s when crack was still real big.
Speaker 2:You can get your car washed for $5.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it was a performance enhancer.
Speaker 2:Well, it's funny. When you were a cop up there, I lived in Wilson, which is right south of Rocky Mount.
Speaker 4:That's right.
Speaker 2:We were there around the same time, weren't we? Yeah, rocky Mount, that's right. We were there around the same time, weren't we? Yeah, rocky Mount's rough. It's a rough area and I don't go back there unless I absolutely got to go through it.
Speaker 4:I had never been there before. I applied for a job and I've never been back since. I take that back. I've been back a couple times.
Speaker 2:So, with being now a criminal law attorney here in town, what do you see? What kind of charges do you represent the most?
Speaker 4:Well, I actually practice all over eastern North Carolina so I've got a case out in Rutherford County so I go all over the state but basically anything from speeding tickets to murder, so what do you? I know I mean I go all over the state but basically anything from speeding tickets to murder, yeah, mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:So what do you—I know New Hanover County here has a big DWI rate that's, I think, one of the largest in the state, because it's you know college town, beach town, One of the highest vehicle insurance rate cities in the state.
Speaker 3:I believe, yeah, because of that.
Speaker 2:Do you see—how many DWIs do you see?
Speaker 4:Quite a few. I don't do as much district court work as I used to. I mainly try to stay in superior court. The more serious crimes murders, assaults, drug cases, things like that.
Speaker 2:What's the one case that comes to mind that you beat, that you still remember. That you'll remember the rest of your life, or your career.
Speaker 4:You're talking about like a DWI.
Speaker 2:DWI to murder, to whatever Most memorable case. Most memorable win.
Speaker 4:The DWI that comes to mind is the. There's a thing called a pre-arrest test that you can ask for, which I only know about it because I didn't learn about it in law school. I learned about it at the intoxilizer course when I was a police officer, and that's basically when you get pulled over. If you feel like you're not impaired and, for whatever reason, you don't think you'll do well in the field sobriety test, you can ask to skip all those and just go straight to the department and blow. That's what's called asking for a pre-arrest test. But you have to specifically say I don't want to do the field sobriety test and I'll go to the station and give you a breath sample. So it's not.
Speaker 4:So, it's not a refusal, and I actually had. He didn't know anything about the pre-arrest test. He just so happened to say no, I don't want to do all that stuff. I don't think I'm drunk, I'll just I'll go down there to the station and blow, but I don't want to do all this. Dancing around on the side of the road and the officer was like yeah, okay, and proceeded to do the field sobriety test anyway.
Speaker 4:So what would be the advantage to doing that, buying yourself time or what? Well, you're not. No, actually you're not buying yourself time because you're cutting out the time that you would have done with the field sobriety test. But the best example I could give is that you can get a DWI being under .07 or .08. So you could blow like I mean, I've seen a .05 written for a DWI because it's based on appreciable impairment, not the number. The legislature said .08, that in and of itself is enough evidence to prove DWI, to prove a appreciable impairment.
Speaker 3:I don't think a lot of people know this. No hell, I didn't even know. I didn't know this. Yeah, I thought it was all based off a number.
Speaker 4:No, I mean because, well, think about it, you can get a DWI for pills, or you can get a DWI for I thought there was a difference between driving while impaired and driving under the influence DUI.
Speaker 4:In some states there are. For example, michigan has a DUI and a DWI statute. I'm not sure what the difference is. The number maybe, okay, I'm not real sure. In North Carolina we only have driving while impaired, and that's operating a motor vehicle on a street or public highway. Why? Your mental and physical faculties are appreciably impaired by alcohol or some other substance, so they can be appreciably impaired on cough medicine. So that's, that's what they're actually proving, is the appreciable impairment.
Speaker 4:So, bringing it back to the pre-arrest test if, like, for example, you have bad balance, you know if you had a bunch of TBIs, like there's a lot of veterans around here, you know they've been blown up multiple times. You know bad knees, bad back, whatever Right. Plus the field sobriety test. The misconception a lot of people have is that it's pass-fail. It's not. You've got three standardized field sobriety tests. Each test has a certain number of clues that can be present and I've seen a DWI charged off one or two clues on two tests and that was enough to give probable cause to arrest, to give probable cause to arrest.
Speaker 3:So I had heard once from Bill Paraguay that I had heard that all the field sobriety tests were designed that were not natural functions of your body to do Heel to toe Not, you don't walk that way. All these were designed to make you fail.
Speaker 4:It's designed to not be easy.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but like you said, if you had a physical impairment, you know, a bad knee, a hurt foot you couldn't do that Well, there's no real reason to do it.
Speaker 4:All you're doing by doing field sobriety tests is giving the officer more evidence to use against you.
Speaker 2:Test is giving the officer more evidence to use against you. So what would you advise somebody to do if they got stopped and they haven't been drinking, but their officers accusing them of?
Speaker 4:drinking. Okay, if you have not had anything to drink, then blow. You know, if I've been going all day I haven't had any alcohol to drink. I get pulled over and the officer says I think you've been drinking, all right, fine, let's do a test, not the field sobriety test. I'd say take me straight down to the station and give me the. Give me the test. So, because if you don't, that's a violation of the law, and I had to actually point it out to the judge and show her the actual statute, because you know they don't teach anything about pre-arrest tests and the only time you'll hear about it is literally in the intoxilizer course as a police officer or other cases if you find it happening in other cases.
Speaker 4:Right, but I mean literally. I asked other just about no other attorneys had even heard of it.
Speaker 3:Just about no other attorneys had even heard of it. And doesn't the intoxicator have to be calibrated from time to time? A certain amount, in order to be accurate, deemed accurate.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I mean it's all computerized and it's supposed to be a redundant system, but basically it's got an alcohol solution in the machine I'm sorry, the instrument. They get very upset if you call it a machine. It's in the instruments and that is what they use to calibrate the machine and to test your breath against. That's what actually gets tested by the. Somebody comes around. It's pretty frequent. It's once every month or two.
Speaker 3:I mean I had heard that was another loophole. You know that they could possibly get with that. It wasn't calibrated so it couldn't read accurate.
Speaker 4:I think that was on the older ones, the new ones if they go out of calibration, you can't use the instrument. Okay, because back in the day when there was a lot of manual calibration, that went on with it. That's where that came into play, okay, but now, now that everything's computerized, it has it, it has a log and it and it automatically checks the and if something goes out they're closing all the loopholes yeah, yeah it's tough best I got some good advice how just uber well, yeah, there's that, but listen, I mean
Speaker 4:mean you know I tell people you have the right to drive after. I mean it's driving while impaired. So as long as you're not impaired, if you've had a couple of drinks, you're allowed to drive. However, it then becomes a sobriety contest with you and the officer and depending on where you're at, you know, if you're at one of the beaches, I mean yeah they.
Speaker 2:Depending on where you're at. If you're at one of the beaches, they're looking for you. Yeah right, CBs.
Speaker 4:Come on vacation, leave on probation that's what they say.
Speaker 2:They're tough, that's for damn sure.
Speaker 4:Any other cases other than DWIs that come to mind. That was a big win for you. Wow, you're putting me on the spot spot. I didn't realize it would be asking to. That's a great idea. While I'm thinking of it, for tv.
Speaker 3:It's for t, excuse me, for t-shirts we could, we could give our clients. Came down on probation, came down on vacation, yeah, yeah, yeah, you got bailed out.
Speaker 2:Here's your shirt this this dude over here, man, he's got, he's got this t-shirt thing going and he's doing a great job at it. It's awesome. I got a bunch of them hats and man, he's like coming up with designs left and right, I'm always got like a little idea sheet, you know.
Speaker 3:But anyway, always marketing, right, right.
Speaker 2:It would work good in Carolina Beach Right man. Carolina Beach man. 25 years ago when I was working with the fire department. That's a long time ago. That and the drive-thru dentist office.
Speaker 3:Oh was there, I didn't know there was a drive-thru. It's an idea. Drive-thru dentist office Quick service.
Speaker 2:That place was a hole back in the day. I'm surprised it's come a long ways since 25 years ago.
Speaker 4:I hope they don't become the next Wrightsville Beach. It'd be nice to be able to have a beach you can still have fun at.
Speaker 3:Wrightsville doesn't feel like beachy to me Not really.
Speaker 2:Not like some of these other places. So you come across the bridge, you're like go home.
Speaker 3:Are you having fun we don't put up with that around here. Plan on parking. That'll be $50.
Speaker 2:I think it's actually $25 a day now to park at Wrightsville Beach. That's the deal. I guess. I don't know, I don't go I just get on my boat go over to lee island yeah, yeah so all right. So back to back to you, david. What's another uh case that comes to mind? That was a big win for you. We gave you time to think of this.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right, start joking about t-shirts there was.
Speaker 4:There was another DWI I had up in Duplin County where we had to try it twice in Superior Court.
Speaker 2:Hold on. Was this the one with the four-wheeler?
Speaker 4:It was the same guy, but it was the first one he actually is. He was from Raleigh and he was hanging out in Duplin County with his girlfriend. They went to a Christmas party and they got into an argument. So she she dropped him off in a field and called a ride and left him there.
Speaker 3:Wow, so where's the four wheeler come into play? Oh, that was the second. Oh, that's the second one. Wow, so where's the four-wheeler come into play? Oh, that was the second one. Oh, that's the second one, okay.
Speaker 4:Yeah, he, so the first one. So we he was. Basically his vehicle was in the field, it was on private property, so you can't get it to be on private property. But they were like, well, we know you were driving before. Then he's like, no, my girl dropped me off in this field. And they were like, yeah, right, the jury believed him. But we had to try that one twice. And then he also had one in district court where he was riding his four-wheeler, you know, in the field, across the street from his grandma's house and crossing the side street. They were like, oh, that's on the highway actually.
Speaker 3:Yeah, they charged him. I had a case. The guy got a dwi on ballhead island, you know, because there's nothing with golf carts out there, there's no cars, but he was drunk and he ran over his mother-in-law. I was like he meditated, maybe it's a total accident. I swear, I mean the case is like I think we had one dude that got a DWI on a horse, that was here One guy on a riding lawnmower. A riding lawnmower, george Jones got one on a horse in a motorized vehicle.
Speaker 2:We had one, I think the guy was at Riceville Beach, as a matter of fact, on a horse and got a DWI. I mean George Jones got a DWI on a John Deere lawnmower.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's definitely a motorized vehicle.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Wow, unless it's a wheelchair, you can't get one in a wheelchair. Well, that's cool.
Speaker 2:I mean we have bonded out some people with that blue.28, 0.27, like driving In the wind, yeah, In the wind. Like, yes, you deserve to go to jail, Like you can't, Come on, you can't do that. I mean Uber's way cheaper than getting a bond and then bonding out and then getting an attorney and then your insurance premium is going up Very expensive.
Speaker 3:Don't do it. That is true Between the bond. What?
Speaker 2:do you say Average between? What do y'all say what money wise I was?
Speaker 3:thinking for an attorney for DWI. I had heard that it starts to like 2,500.
Speaker 2:I'm talking about between the lawyer fees, the insurance, the bonding out.
Speaker 4:How much so the the expense is the insurance.
Speaker 3:Well, actually I had one 15 years ago and the only thing I've ever gotten that was DWI. 15 years ago Mine was high, paraguay represented me for that, took it the whole two years and got it from a. I was a level one, got it to a four, which is your best case scenario, and I was just so worried that this was the end of my career, my license, everything. But so I found an insurance company that had a homeowner's first time forgiveness rate for DWIs. So if you own the home, good Lord, and yeah, that's a good deal, yeah, shout out to Heimberg if you own the home.
Speaker 4:Good Lord, and yeah, that's a good deal. Yeah, shout out to.
Speaker 3:Heimberg Insurance. By the way, it had to be tied in with a homeowner's policy. I know, no, this was strictly just a car, but it was because you were lower risk, because you were homeowners your first one, you had nothing else on your record and mine only went up like 20 bucks.
Speaker 3:Wow, yeah, but as I was 15 years, yeah, this has been a while back, I mean it's a long time ago. But I would tell people you know, like if you have this and you meet this criteria, this and this you know. But I mean you got between, like you said, the insurance, the attorney fees, possible bond fees may or may not, as far as that goes and then usually an attorney, if I'm correct, they will advise you to go take an alcohol class to show that you're trying to be progressive. An alcohol assessment, yeah, alcohol assessment class.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and sometimes you're even required to go ahead and put a scram brace on before.
Speaker 3:Right, that too. Depending on your level, how many times it's been, you know how you're trying to avoid jail time. So yeah. And you got cost to all this stuff, so it can really add up.
Speaker 4:I've had my clients tell me that their insurance went up by like five times. Yeah, I've heard that story yeah.
Speaker 3:Or drop you.
Speaker 4:Yeah, if you can even keep it yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm not.
Speaker 3:So I mean you're looking at total cost for a DWI around $10,000 to $12,000, I would guess.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so better yet, spend that $40 to take an Uber ride home. I'm telling you it's well worth it.
Speaker 4:It was amazing when because I was in Wilmington when Uber came and they've gone back up again. But man, for a little while DWIs dropped off, they just basically stopped. Nobody was getting DWIs anymore. Smart. People have gotten used to it again, so they're back to risking it.
Speaker 2:I remember when there was a bunch of cabs running around here. You remember that, mm-hmm I don't think I've. You can hardly ever see one every now and then. Well, maybe on Friday and Saturday nights down here, but I hell, I stay away. I stay away from downtown, yeah, unless I'm down here for work. You know I don't come down here for anything, so all right. Anything else you know that you represent. Is there any big companies or insurance agencies that you represent?
Speaker 4:Yeah, for those of you who are concealed carry holders or I mean you don't even actually have to have a concealed carry permit there's a company called USCCA or US Concealed Carry Association. They do. They sell concealed carry insurance or use of force insurance.
Speaker 2:I've got one.
Speaker 3:Now you had a client that had to use this right. I'm representing him right now.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 3:I mean, if we can discuss it, he literally had only had it like a month or two, I think, before something happened. Is that right? He hadn't had it long, hadn't had it long, hadn't had it long. And then he had a situation that a person was he had to shoot.
Speaker 4:It was a non-lethal use of force. I mean, he had to use his firearm to protect his wife and he did everything exactly the way they I mean, if I'd been standing there with him he did everything exactly right Left the scene, made sure he was safe, immediately called the police, met. The police didn't give a statement but he was well after he got out of the hospital because he had a pretty serious medical condition that was aggravated by the stress. So he was charged with assault with a deadly weapon inflicting serious injury With intent. We bought it on out. So he was charged with assault with a deadly weapon inflicting serious injury With intent.
Speaker 3:We bought it yeah he may have been originally with the intent to kill, but they indicted him on the lower level, assault with a deadly weapon. But this service covered his attorney fees and his bond fees. They cover everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that was amazing.
Speaker 3:They paid me Cover everything. Yeah, that was amazing.
Speaker 4:They paid me. We've hired three experts. Two of them are from out of state, flying one in from the Use of Force guy, we're flying him in from Utah and we're flying a crime scene recreationist in from Ohio.
Speaker 3:Wow, and we hired a cardiologist out of Chapel Hill at a UNC to come down. I imagine all this isn't cheap, oh no.
Speaker 4:And it didn't cost him a dime. I mean, we went down they called me the night that it happened and I went down to embed him at the hospital in Rocky Mount at 9 o'clock on a Sunday night and you know, that was literally a matter of hours after it happened. And uh, and then once he, we, once we found out he had a bond, we went and turned him in um, brought Rob with me. So I mean he literally turned him in, bailed him out. Of course they, they decided to play a little game and wait a week and take out a misdemeanor.
Speaker 3:That's right he had a misdemeanor charge on him.
Speaker 4:So when we found out about but didn't tell us, so we found out about it, went and turned him in. But because it was on a Friday and he was already on a, he was already on bond, even though the underlying charges were for the same event. They took out two sets of charges Pitt County. Their magistrates are not exactly what you would call smart.
Speaker 2:Well, I can say that about a few men.
Speaker 4:Well, I mean, the officer that served the warrant was like your honor, he's already on a bond for this case. He didn't go out and catch new charges and they were like nope, don't have time to think. So he had to sit in jail all weekend, Didn't have his medication, I think he ended up getting bronchitis. But again, point being is that that company paid for his bond, paid for the experts, paid for his legal fees.
Speaker 3:Tell everybody that is out there, because we've got a lot of gun owners that are out there listening. What company was this again?
Speaker 4:It's the US Concealed Carry Association, or USCCA.
Speaker 3:USCCA.
Speaker 2:And it's cheap, and if you're a veteran or a first responder, they give you a discount too. I think it's like $20 or $25 a month and it covers up to millions dollars in coverage it's two million dollars in legal fees and bonding and yeah so nice, that's awesome and, for the record, I'm not compensated by them.
Speaker 4:To say I just I'm one of their attorney providers and it's a good service.
Speaker 2:I think people know, I think I think it's a great service. I mean that's why I signed up for it. So I mean that's why I got it. And they also gave me like a free little bag and stuff.
Speaker 4:Yeah they'll send you a bag. Yeah, they send you, kind of goodies.
Speaker 2:They send you a lot of junk emails.
Speaker 4:Well, it's like anybody yeah, Once they get that email, they're going to use.
Speaker 3:I've got a conference next week and I'll see them there. There's them, and there's another company that's similar to them, Legal Shield or something. Yeah, I think that's it.
Speaker 4:Legal Shield is a little different, but there's the Armed Citizens Network or Armed Citizens Defense League or something like that. There's several smaller companies out there that are doing it, but the big one right now, and there there are people that have. You know, there's stuff on YouTube people complaining about them, but I've been working with them for four or five years and I've represented several people for them and gotten not guilties or dismissals on everything and um, they, they pay, they, they don't question it. I mean that's awesome. Yeah, it's definitely worth it. I mean it's like 300 bucks a year, I think, for like there.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So, david, tell everybody at home how they can get ahold of you If they, um, if they need you down here in Wilmington, pender, brunswick, anywhere in North Carolina, pretty much.
Speaker 4:You can just Google David Gross Attorney. The name of the firm is the Gross Law Group. We're based out of here in Wilmington, but I have cases all over eastern North Carolina, all the way out to Wake County, all the way out to the western part of the state.
Speaker 2:Okay.
Speaker 4:I don't charge for consult, so if you have a question about a criminal defense situation, you can feel free to call me, and if I can help you, I'll help you. If not, I'll recommend somebody that can Awesome, awesome.
Speaker 2:So by now since excuse me, hell, it's 29 minutes in We've only got about a minute left. So, david, thank you for coming on. I appreciate it. It was awesome.
Speaker 4:Well, I appreciate you having me on.
Speaker 2:It's about time. We've been talking about it for a while.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I'll be coming back.
Speaker 2:All right, that's what I'm talking about, we'll have another topic discussed. Yeah, maybe we can come up with another game plan when we're all three flounder gig in this season.
Speaker 4:Well, that'd be nice If we have a flounder season that would be great.
Speaker 2:All right, so give it up for Mr Gross one more time, all right. Well, until then, I'm Rob, I'm Chad and this is. This is Dave.
Speaker 3:Right on.
Speaker 2:So we'll check you out next time Later.
Speaker 1:You've been listening to Off the Hook with Chad and Rob. We hope you've enjoyed the show. Make sure to like, rate and review, and be sure to follow us for notifications for another exciting episode. But in the meantime, you can go to our website at wwwoffthehookbillcom to see more. So until next time, stay out of trouble, or it'll be you that needs to get off the hook. See you soon.
